SlickEdit Community

SlickEdit Product Discussion => SlickEdit® => SlickEdit® Core for Eclipse™ => Topic started by: PlanetPratt on March 17, 2008, 08:45:49 pm

Title: Core vs Plugin
Post by: PlanetPratt on March 17, 2008, 08:45:49 pm
What's the difference between SlickEdit Core for Eclipse and SlickEdit Plug-in for Eclipse?
  (*Chris*)
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: ScottW, VP of Dev on March 18, 2008, 02:43:57 pm
Hi Chris,

Excellent question. Although both products are fully compatible with the latest version of Eclipse, and provide the same editing features and views, SlickEdit Core has improved integration into the Eclipse environment and works seamlessly with the Eclipse update manager.   Also, licensing is different for these two products.  The SlickEdit Plug-in is a perpetual license offering Maintenance and Support as an optional, additional charge. SlickEdit Core is licensed as an annual subscription, which includes a one-year Maintenance and Support Service.

--Scott
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: Ryan on March 18, 2008, 09:30:17 pm
Also (probably falling under the category of "improved integration into the Eclipse environment") the Linux version of Core has no requirements on setting JAVAHOME, LD_LIBRARY_PATH, or starting with any type of script.

- Ryan
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: Kappa on April 01, 2008, 05:04:04 am
so SlickEdit plugin discontinued?
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: PlanetPratt on April 01, 2008, 06:14:40 am
According to an e-mail I received from SlickEdit regarding my SlickEdit Plugin License:

Quote
The SlickEdit® Plug-In for Eclipse™ has been discontinued, and no further updates are planned.

So I'd have to say yes.  :-[
  (*Chris*)
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: buggyfunbunny on April 06, 2008, 07:16:43 pm
SlickEdit Core is licensed as an annual subscription, which includes a one-year Maintenance and Support Service.

--Scott

You should post that statement over on the regular SlickEdit board.  There were concerns raised, during the recent beta, that this was what you intended to do with regular SE.  People should be informed that you have taken this step.  It may be that I am the last to notice this, nevertheless...
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: Ryan on April 07, 2008, 03:18:43 pm
@ PlanetPratt and Kappa (and anyone else), yes, the SlickEdit Plug-In for Eclipse has been discontinued.  We are moving forward with SlickEdit Core for Eclipse at it's reduced price and subscription model. 

You have a couple of options if you are an existing SlickEdit Plug-In user.  If you are currently on a maintenence and support plan, and you wish to switch to Core, you can do so for 2 years at a reduced price.  If you do not wish to switch to Core right now, and wish to stay on maintenence and support for SlickEdit Plug-In, you can do so for another year.

@ bfb

Quote
You should post that statement over on the regular SlickEdit board.  There were concerns raised, during the recent beta, that this was what you intended to do with regular SE.  People should be informed that you have taken this step.  It may be that I am the last to notice this, nevertheless...

We made this change for SlickEdit Core for Eclipse...not SlickEdit...???

- Ryan
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: vavaroutsos on April 08, 2008, 04:28:48 am
I have been a slickedit user for many years. I was ready to buy the eclipse plugin when I learned it had been discontinued for this core product. I really don't care for the subscription license option and I don't think it is going to benefit slickedit. Why not offer a perpetual license option as well for $199 and let users take their choice?

~petev
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: DaveyC on April 08, 2008, 10:48:34 am
What concerns me is that there is no floating licence anymore. We have a couple of fulltime plugin users and a few part timers. The floating licence suits our needs.
Now I have to convince my company to buy licences that may not be used. I'm sure this does benefit slickedit, otherwise they wouldn't have done it!
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: Ryan on April 08, 2008, 02:45:52 pm
Our sales team will gladly discuss any licensing or sales related issues with you if you contact them at either sales@slickedit.com or 1-800-934-3348.

- Ryan
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: bercikr on April 09, 2008, 09:03:40 pm
So please help me clarify, as I am currently in the midst of Evaluating SlickEdit Core for Eclipse 3.3... Will this product continue to be supported and released as an Eclipse 'plugin'... or is this the last SlickEdit product being made for eclipse?

-r
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: Ryan on April 09, 2008, 09:07:54 pm
So please help me clarify, as I am currently in the midst of Evaluating SlickEdit Core for Eclipse 3.3... Will this product continue to be supported and released as an Eclipse 'plugin'... or is this the last SlickEdit product being made for eclipse?

-r

Yes...SlickEdit Core for Eclipse will continue to be released, supported, updated, and improved.

- Ryan
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: wsappington on April 29, 2008, 04:24:12 pm
Sorry for showing up late to the party but I just noticed that the Plugin is no longer offered on the Products page and went digging 'til I found this thread.  I've read it and I'm still not sure what this means in terms of cost.  Maybe this question would be best answered by a sales person, but I'm sure others have or will have this question as well so I figured I'd get the answer here where it's available to everybody.

I just purchased the Plugin with an annual support agreement last August, I haven't even had it a year and now I have to buy something different to stay current with Slickedit in the Eclipse environment?  What will the Core product cost me if I purchase it on my own (not through the company) as I did with regular Slickedit and the Plugin, full price?  I spent over $300 for the plugin and a year's maintenance/support, do I now have to pay another $100 to stay current?

-will
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: Ryan on April 29, 2008, 05:16:22 pm
Hi Will,

As much as I would like to answer your question in complete detail, I can't for a couple reasons.  First because I am not 100% sure of all the details in regards to existing SlickEdit Plug-in users switching to SlickEdit Core, and also because we try to keep the community forums largely technical  :-[.

If you contact sales they will thoroughly explain all of the options available to you.  As an introduction, maybe some of my comments from above are of interest:

Quote
You have a couple of options if you are an existing SlickEdit Plug-In user.  If you are currently on a maintenence and support plan, and you wish to switch to Core, you can do so for 2 years at a reduced price.  If you do not wish to switch to Core right now, and wish to stay on maintenence and support for SlickEdit Plug-In, you can do so for another year.

Hopefully sales can provide an acceptable solution for you so that going forward, you can stay current with our product.

- Ryan
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: wsappington on April 30, 2008, 03:09:50 pm
OK, I can understand your position.  I was reading fast and missed the stuff you quoted, my bad, but good to know there's at least a discount. 

Here's a concern that's more on the technical side - does Core work better than the Plugin?  When I started with the 3.2 plugin I noticed a lot of issues, many of which were fixed with 3.3, and I've kinda gotten used to the ones that were left - reset line modify markers in the left margin doesn't work, help in dialog boxes doesn't work, the pushed bookmark stack sometimes gets corrupted or otherwise goes flaky and I can't get back to the beginning, clicking any of the other Eclipse views often causes the cursor in the editor view to get reset to the top of the first buffer in the list, and a few others.  The Plugin isn't perfect, but it was becoming a mature product.  I'm concerned that if I switch to Core, I'll be back to dealing with an immature product and taking a step back in terms of functionality or stability.  If Core truly is an improvement over the Plugin (and if so, how is it better?), I'll consider switching now, or soon.  But if it's still getting the kinks ironed out of it, I'll wait 'til it's more mature.  It has to be a step forward or it's not worth it, regardless of the cost.

-will
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: Ryan on April 30, 2008, 09:04:55 pm
Great post.

Quote
I'm concerned that if I switch to Core, I'll be back to dealing with an immature product and taking a step back in terms of functionality or stability...If Core truly is an improvement over the Plugin (and if so, how is it better?)

I don't think you will take a step back in terms of functionality or stability because, as Scott touched on earlier, the current versions of both products provide the same editing features and views.  Core was created so that we could provide a lower price point with a subscription, and better integration with the Eclipse environment (Update Manager support, no environment variable requirements on Linux, no 3rd party installer).  In this sense, Core is a more mature product. 

Going forward, Core will be updated to include new SlickEdit features, as well as increased integration with Eclipse functionality.  I appreciate how you have come to value increased stability, dealing with some of the issues in earlier versions of our old plug-in :).  We will continue to make improvements in this area...it's our #1 priority.  One of the great things about our Eclipse plug-in is that it will always be based on a minor release of SlickEdit, .0.1 or later.  You don't have to deal with the bugs in SlickEdit features that get ironed out during our minor releases.

Quote
help in dialog boxes doesn't work

This one is a high priority for us right now, and fits well with our goal of better integration into Eclipse.  In 3.2.x we got our help "native" and indexed in the Eclipse Help system, and now I think we can look into fully integrating our SlickEdit Help buttons with Eclipse.

Quote
clicking any of the other Eclipse views often causes the cursor in the editor view to get reset to the top of the first buffer in the list

This I've not seen before...have you noticed is it always a certain view that causes this behavior?

Quote
reset line modify markers in the left margin doesn't work

Thanks for the report on this one...I assume you are talking about the Save option?  This looks like it's being ignored in the plug-in, I'll file a defect and get it fixed in a future release if I can't hotfix it.  In the meantime, if you would like to bind this function to a key it will do the job for you on demand:

Code: [Select]
_command void reset_modified_lines() name_info(','VSARG2_READ_ONLY|VSARG2_REQUIRES_EDITORCTL)
{
   save_pos(auto p);
   top(); up();
   while(!down()) {
      _lineflags(0, VSLF_MODIFY | VSLF_INSERTED_LINE);
   }
   restore_pos(p);
}

Anyways, I hope this helps to explain some of the "mystery" behind Core...and hopefully we can get some of your remaining issues straightened out soon.  Thanks for the interest and feedback.

- Ryan
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: wsappington on May 01, 2008, 06:08:54 pm
Quote
Quote
clicking any of the other Eclipse views often causes the cursor in the editor view to get reset to the top of the first buffer in the list

This I've not seen before...have you noticed is it always a certain view that causes this behavior?

It doesn't happen all the time and, it seems, not with every view.  I just ran a quick test.  I expanded a project in the Package Explorer view by clicking the '+' until the java source files were listed, and then opened a file "FileA.java".  Paged down a few pages and then used push_bookmark() to navigate to a symbol in another file, "FileB.java".  Then I expanded the '+' on another project in the Package Explorer view and the editor cursor popped to the top of the file (line 1, col 1) in FileA.java.  I normally keep the Package Explorer view minimized to maximize the editor view real estate, and I've had the same thing happen when I restore the P.E. view to look at another project.

In a second test I repeated the FileA and FileB open/navigation, and then restored the Outline view on the right side (I keep it minimized as well).  This had no effect on the editor view.  But when I went over to the P.E. view and expanded another project, the editor view changed as described above.  Other actions in the P.E. view (like minimizing or restoring) also have the same effect, but not always.  So it seems that the P.E. view is the main culprit, but I think I've seen it happen when clicking in other views, though not sure.
Title: Re: Core vs Plugin
Post by: Ryan on July 11, 2008, 03:08:12 pm
Quote
reset line modify markers in the left margin doesn't work

Thanks for the report on this one...I assume you are talking about the Save option?  This looks like it's being ignored in the plug-in, I'll file a defect and get it fixed in a future release if I can't hotfix it.  In the meantime, if you would like to bind this function to a key it will do the job for you on demand:...

This has been fixed in 3.4...but is not in the beta.

- Ryan